Who counts as a daughter

Editor's note: The following text is a transcript of a podcast story. To listen to the story, click on the arrow beneath the headline above.

MARY REICHARD, HOST: Coming next on The World and Everything In It: Daughters of the American Revolution and gender ideology.

When DAR, the Daughters of the American Revolution, was founded in 1890, an applicant had to prove she was a direct descendent of either a patriot or someone who provided aid to a patriot. And, of course, she had to be female.

NICK EICHER, HOST: But that second requirement has now been written out, leaving behind a remnant fighting to preserve the organization’s history. 

Here is WORLD’s Myrna Brown.

MYRNA BROWN: Laura McDonald loves the founding story of the DAR. She says it matters—because the organization exists in the first place after women were barred from Sons of the American Revolution.

LAURA MCDONALD: The Sons formed their organization in 1889, and when the women wanted to be a part of that, they were told no, because you’re not a man and you’re not a son. Well, the women decided they would form their own then, The Daughters of the American Revolution.

In 2023 she was preparing to give a talk about the DAR for her local Rotary Club in Texas—planning to highlight that very origin story; but had second thoughts.

LAURA MCDONALD: I was going to mess with the men in the audience and say, sorry fellas, the DAR is for women only. And as soon as I was about to type those words out, I thought about the former health secretary.

She was thinking about the man known as Rachel Levine, the assistant health secretary in the Biden Administration who presented himself as a woman.

LAURA MCDONALD: And I thought… what are we going to do when he or somebody like him in a very prominent position decides that he wants to join the DAR?

McDonald had no idea the question of who qualifies for membership had already been broached, debated, and voted on.

AUDIO: Good Morning, good morning.

Audio from DAR’s 132nd Continental Congress in Washington, where the vote took place. McDonald did not attend the meeting. Her mother did.

LAURA MCDONALD: She left feeling uneasy and confused about what happened. Of course, she did not vote for the amendment.

The amendment changed the organization’s bylaws to prohibit discrimination against otherwise eligible applicants, including on the basis of sexual orientation.

Her mother’s uneasiness prompted McDonald to find the recording of the meeting. She's listened to it over and over, trying to make sense of what happened that day in 2023.

AUDIO: And adding NSDAR and its chapters may not discriminate against an eligible applicant based on race, religion, sexual orientation…

First, a motion to amend an article that had been part of the organization’s bylaws for more than a century. Then a discussion led by the president general.

AUDIO: Is there any debate?....

Jennifer Meese, a delegate from Pennsylvania, was first at the microphone.

AUDIO: With the proposed change in wording to the bylaw, would our chapters be able to still vote not to admit into our chapter a person whose birth certificate has been altered by their state to indicate they are female, even though they were born a male?

PRESIDENT GENERAL: If a person’s…if a person’s birth certificate..certified birth certificate states female, you must, they are eligible for membership.

Judy Lindsey, from Wyoming, also spoke against the change.

AUDIO: I think the Daughters of the American Revolution should be able to define what a woman is, scientifically, with two X chromosomes; not one with an X and a Y.

But the majority of delegates, like Mary Hayes from New Mexico, supported the amendment.

AUDIO: The legal counsel has strongly advised this by law because currently we’re vague. This 501c3 designation by the IRS would be revoked. We would be revoked if we discriminate against protected individuals, and that DAR’s history of past discrimination would be taken into account when evaluating current discrimination.

The amendment passed, allowing men membership into the Daughters of the American Revolution.

AUDIO: You may be seated. There being two thirds in the affirmative, the amendment is adopted and the bylaw is amended as specified...

[APPLAUSE]

Laura McDonald says she later questioned DAR leaders about conflating the organization’s past racial discrimination with so-called “trans” discrimination.

LAURA MCDONALD: They try to liken it to discrimination against black women, which to me is offensive, to try to compare men who claim to be women to black women.

She also questioned the organization’s legal rationale.

LAURA MCDONALD: Well we tried to dig a little deeper and say okay, well, who was the legal counsel and what was their advice? That’s when we get absolutely no answers.

WORLD also reached out to the current president general of the organization. But no one responded. So we contacted Randall Wenger, chief counsel for the Independence Law Center in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania.

RANDALL WENGER: An organization like the Daughters of the American Revolution is not at risk of losing tax exempt status by refusing membership to men. Even if those men identify as women.

Wenger says because the DAR was founded as a sex-separated organization, it has legal protections that allow it to limit membership accordingly. He says organizations that have lost tax exemption took extreme positions on public policy:

RANDALL WENGER: …but women’s groups, especially those involved in expression of women’s issues are not contrary to public policy.

Since that vote three years ago, McDonald has been on a mission.

LAURA MCDONALD: We have a Facebook group, called Daughters Advocating for Restoration.

McDonald says she’s tried multiple times to get the national bylaws amended. Each failed effort has been costly.

LAURA MCDONALD: We have essentially been accused of being hateful and bigoted and spreading vitriol...

But in August of 2025, McDonald made a discovery. Thirty chapters in ten states can compel the president general to call a special meeting.

LAURA MCDONALD: We will vote on a resolution that will define a woman.

McDonald says even if this effort fails:

LAURA MCDONALD: My faith rests in Jesus Christ and all of this is in service to Him, ultimately. 

Out of nearly three thousand DAR chapters nationwide, McDonald says thirty-eight have so far joined the call for a special meeting. It’s scheduled for October in Washington. 

But she does not expect the president general to confirm it any sooner than the bylaws require—in September.

Reporting for WORLD, I’m Myrna Brown.

WORLD Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of WORLD Radio programming is the audio record.